If we look at the Grand Inquisition, it was made up of the educated of the time and they were well aware, inter alia, of the fact that the world is the centre of the universe, accordingly, it was quite right of them to incarcerate someone that should suggest that this was not so. Unfirtunately for them, Galileo was right.
Even though Galileo was educated in the same system as the Inquisitors, he was able to ask the question why is this so and is it right.
Some hundreds of years later Darwin was likewise persecuted for again questioning the accuracy of the details of the subject matter being taught at that time by the educated elite. and again, Darwin was right.
This has happened throughout the years and every one that questions the teachings of the day is reviled and often persecuted, some times severely so but eventually they are frequently right and their ideas win the day.
I am hoping that the being right continues to win the day because we are presently faced with a global problem which is not just an academic problem for the advancement of our knowledge, this problem could well result in the extermination of all life on this planet for a number of years, if not correctly addressed.
My worry is that we have now an opposition which is just like the Inquisition, it knows that there is no global warming caused by human activity and there is no need to do anything about it because we have god to look after us. Unfortunately, we seem to be ruled presently by these people of strong religious belief such that one of our senators claims to believe in god when there is no evidence of the existance of such a creature, whereas, he claims that, despite all the evidence of global ice caps melting etc, there isn’t enough evidence of global warming for him to press for some appropriate action.
It seems to me that there is too much teaching in our education system and not enough questioning!
We should be teaching our students priciples of maths, science, etc but we should also be encouraging them to question what they are taught and to understand why things are considered to be so. The trouble with our present leaders is that they have been taught things from a religious aspect and they are unable to put that training aside and consider things from a logical view point, for example, Kevin Andrews preaches freedom of choice but when the Northern Territory voted for voluntary Euthanasia, he was able to override that choice as being not one that he could live with, so much for freedom of choice?
Frankly, I’m pleased to be old because I can’t really see that, with the world leadership we have today, there can be any great odds that they will be able to come up with a solution to the global warming problem, and if they should get so lucky, there is no chance that they will be able to solve the over population problem.
The trouble is, now days parents send their children to school to be disciplined and taught comformity and not to be a pain in the arse by asking awkward questions and to just do as they are told. Which makes for disillusioned young adults with no aim other than to make money which is their measure of success or to be no hopers!
Where is the old fashioned idea of learning for learnings sake?
Grandad,
You have no authority to make that final statement that “now days parents send their children to school to be disciplined…” etc. I think the reality is that people still want their children to question things, and grow up smarter and more aware than their own generation, and you’re plain wrong about people wanting to have their children disciplined and taught conformity. What on earth made you think this in the first place? I’d also like to point out that my own mother went back to work after our births as soon as she was able. And that most people who don’t believe in global warming are my the baby boomers (guilt complex). Nowadays I hear mothers talking about the science which shows that the formative years of a childs life require a mother to be present etc etc
This is not an observation on life, this is you being a old man!
I assume you’re talking about Tony Abbot – I’ve heard someone postulate that when a party knows they are going to lose an election, they put in the idiots to take the fall so that when they replace them after the election the new guy looks like a bloody genius and everyone goes “He’s so much better than the last guy, lets vote for him”.
~Gemmell
simon, I don’t need authority to make statements, but I would like to think that I have a basis for any I may make.
The basis for my statement re using schools for discipline and to stop being asked question was from listening to ABC talk back radio, talking to your Auntie Loraine, and listening to various people purporting to have experience in the education and child raising fields.
One of these experts was the NSW chief magistrate in the childrens courts and she said that she often had to ask why a child was not accompanied by a parent and the reply was usually that the parent had to be at work.
I think that the mothers that you talk to are of your intelligence level and therefore have a greater degree of responsibility. As to your mother working soon after your birth, I would point out that she always made arrangements for you to be cared for, usually in your own home, and she and your father were always there when required. In fact, they are still there for your every day events even though you and your siblings are now 30 or there abouts, e.g. your Dad’s religious attendance at all your and Kate’s sporting events!
You may poo-hoo talk back radio but it is represented on the ABC by a very wide group of people and the guest speakers are often very learned people, politicians and media staff etc. Some things people say phone in about are really so mundane but others are really challenging and thought provoking. It is interesting that one can have the radio on in the background and not appear to be taking any notice and then something is mentioned and one is immediately listening.
Regards to sounding like an old man, I am an old man. I like to think that I consider things but I have to be influenced by my experiences. One of the things I have learned is that you can’t be half right and half wrong emphatically, e.g. you can’t be half an atheist or royalist, you are or you are not and if you are you cannot argue the opposite point of view with any meaning or honesty. You can listen and try to teach your challenger but if you start to accept their point of view you have changed your point of view.
Most things are not that important so they are just to be argued as the case may be. This is the way to learn I suppose.
Regarding the last piece of your comment, I was referring to Tony Abbot, I am not so sure that the opposition will be able to get rid of him if they get elected at the next election, this would be terrible for the whole country, he is such a bigot!
If only the bad things are reported then you perceive the world getting worse. Because of the advancements in media, everybody is goddamn paranoid about their children being abducted by pedophiles, despite the fact that it has increased less than the population increase. The fact that you hear “more of them” is because there are more people and anytime there is an incident (or for that matter, a shark attack), it becomes national news. It doesn’t mean the world is descending into chaos.
The source of your information is already biased, the chief magistrate only sees the worst side of it, talk back radio only gets calls from people who listen to talk back radio (which instantly excludes pretty much anyone of my generation). The only one I give any credit to is Lorraine, who see’s a very small proportion of the total schooling population.
Add to this that I am working with Alfred-Deakin high school to install an Aquaponics system so that they can teach their children all about natural lifecycles, science, and where food comes from (i.e. not woolworths). They have funding to do this, and even if the parents are just sending them off to school, the teachers give a shit, and they are doing their best to make a difference.
You CAN NOT say that “now days parents send their children to school to be disciplined and taught comformity”. The fact is that in every generation there are people who subscribe to that philosophy, and as the population increases, so does that group (as does every other group). Because it’s reported more, does not mean that every parent does it.
Simon, Iam a little bemused by your comments because they seem to be unrelated to the subject that initiated this dialogue and also because you seem to be making the same mistakes that you are finding me guilty of!!
It is inevitable that one has to be influenced by discussion, media releases and pseudo and/or genuine experts ( it is up to every individual to work out which is or who is genuine ). When I was younger, I was always told that there was more ideas in a cinema audience than there is in a faculty professorial chamber. I think that this observation was initially made by Einstein! My point is that my data base is far wider than the one that you seem to be limiting yourself to. I listen to all this, mainly as background noise and prick up my ears when something I am interested in is mentioned, it’s wonderful how one can be really engrossed in something yet still be alert to things mentioned in the hearing range ( not too far these days ) especially if you disagree with the statements made.
The thing that I have always tried to do is to listen to ideas and advice then make up my own mind what is good and what is nonesense. The wider the range of the data base the more information there is available on which to make a decision.
My data base indicates to me that parents that are interested in their children’s education often exceed their qualifications i.e. they want a say in the curriculum and marking of students when they really have no idea how their child is performing in a class set-up nor have most of them got any real understanding of the various subjects ( a truly bias statement is, how can any one subject their child to religious instruction when there is no evidence that a god even exists ) This may seem irrelevant but a present discussion here in NSW is all about whether children that don’t attend religious instruction should be taught an alternative subject such as ethics. This seems a trivial subject but you would find it hard to understand the vehemence of the opposing sides to this matter, there is no effort to discuss the subject rationally, and there is no real concern for what would be best for the students.
If I have a child with an appendicitis problem, I would expect the doctor to tell me what was wrong and what he proposed to effect a cure but I wouldn’t expect to then be able to tell him how he should go about it. Likewise, we have trained teachers, most of whom are very devoted to their profession, and when I send my child to school I expect them to give me a run-down on what goes on, i.e. what is being taught, but I don’t expect to be able to tell the teachers how they should go about teaching. Even more importantly, I don’t want the teachers to be told how they should be doing their job by some ignorant parent that thinks that their little Johnny is gods gift to the world.
It is important that parents be interested in their children’s education but they should only help out by doing things to provide extra facilities for the school as required and recommended by the school staff.
With regard to the comment on the chief magistrate, naturally she was biased, she was talking about the subject that she was best able to offer advice upon, if she had been social worker or a policewoman, she would have possibly had another point of view but my observation was that, even though these others were in much the same field of activity, their opinion wasn’t too dissimilar.
With regard to your comment that my generation abandoned their children more frequently than they do now days, where on earth did you get the ” authority ” to make such a statement. I can’t recall too many children being abandoned by choice by their parents in my day and I’ve never seen a report on this subject!
In fact I’m not too sure that too many children are abandoned now days although there seems to be more children sleeping out on the streets now days even in comparison to, say, 40 years ago. I couldn’t comment with any real confidence? Some of this moving out of children from home may well be due to the way that the law now recognises the right of ever younger children to move out of home and the parents can’t do much about it, or so it would seem. You could almost say that now days the problem is more the children abandoning the parents!